[dns-operations] After Google Mail, Google Docs, Google Wave... Google DNS

[Bob Paolucci]

Im not so sure Google would strike back...

I know they were upset with us with we started notification insertion
and it was "interfering" with their webpage.
Did not do ANYTHING to stem the use of said insertion platforms, even
when they openly commented about us in the media.

I see a rising storm against google.  
First the crazy Rupert Murdoch vs google struggle, which he seems to be
gaining clout with other media groups joining in.
Content is king, why should google leverage other peoples content to
make money without some sort of profit sharing?
Again, the evil dollar wins but it is a valid question.

When it comes down to it, there are many reasons why an ISP may want
recusive resolution to stay "on net", it's a wealth of info for security
purposes, gives a very simple avenue of filtering content that may be
illegal (as ugly as this may be), possibly protect their customer base
from very popular phishing sites, and of course offers a nice bit of
info regarding what clients are doing.  All ISP's like to keep control
of their customer base, none of us want the "DUMB PIPE" nightmare
scenario.
*waits for the shoe throwing over above comments*. :)

If a huge number of users did happen to go to offnet dns servers, an ISP
may seriously consider policy routing all port 53 traffic as suggested
by Paul. (not that I agree with it)

Again, would Google rock the boat over some free DNS service?  I doubt
it with BING / Microsoft waiting around the corner to pick up the pieces
and gain from Google's losses.



-----Original Message-----
From: dns-operations-bounces at lists.dns-oarc.net
[mailto:dns-operations-bounces at lists.dns-oarc.net] On Behalf Of Joe
Greco
Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 10:36 PM
To: Paul Vixie
Cc: dns-operations at mail.dns-oarc.net
Subject: Re: [dns-operations] After Google Mail, Google Docs,Google
Wave... Google DNS


> > From: Joe Greco <jgreco at ns.sol.net>
> > Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2009 14:24:23 -0600 (CST)
> > 
> > However, that's just the cynical me.  I have to say, Google's in a 
> > great position to Do The Right Thing with this.  It could be a real 
> > winner for people who need an alternative to their poisoned-kool-aid

> > ISP resolvers.
> 
> seems to me that isp's will just policy-route this address to their 
> own servers, and then let other udp/53 through.  they want eyeballs, 
> they don't need to irritate the small number of people who want to run

> their own recursives.  by making a single big dns resolver that 
> everybody will want to use, google will make it easier for isp's to 
> only pirate the traffic they actually want to pirate.

Paul,

I want to see that happen.  Because unlike most other alternative DNS
services, Google can strike back, and strike back hard.

OpenDNS would have fairly limited recourse should an ISP decide to do
something like what you suggest to them.  Maybe negative publicity,
maybe lawsuits, etc., but quite frankly if a service provider were to
putz with OpenDNS-bound traffic, they'll get away with it - at least for
a while.

Google?  Can you imagine, just the negative publicity from them merely
putting a conditional warning up on their homepage, if you come from
$BADISP, where it tells you that your ISP is interfering with your 
freedom to choose, and that you should call and complain?

And that's a frickin' love tap compared to what Google *could* do.

Given that the ISP is already messing with Google's traffic, what if
Google were to silently start messing with return traffic to $BADISP?
What if it were made to look like it was the ISP that was actually doing
it?  It could get really devious, really quickly...

The Internet is _so_ dependent on some basic level of cooperation and
trust.  We sometimes forget that this implies that you can really throw
a wrench in the works pretty easily.

So, it'd be a stupid move to mess with Google DNS.  If and when it
happens, it will most definitely be a "popcorn event."  I enjoy a good
show, and a good bowl of popcorn, so yes, I want to see that happen.
Anyone want to place bets on who'll win?  I'll put money on Google...

... JG
-- 
Joe Greco - sol.net Network Services - Milwaukee, WI -
http://www.sol.net "We call it the 'one bite at the apple' rule. Give me
one chance [and] then I won't contact you again." - Direct Marketing
Ass'n position on e-mail spam(CNN) With 24 million small businesses in
the US alone, that's way too many apples.
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